Rod Dreher’s diary, my subscription-only Substack newsletter, has been scanned. I found this letter from 2021 that was sent by an Orthodox Christian friend to me. However, she had spent a lot of time in the occult. I was granted permission by her to publish it. Perhaps you are interested in reading it.
People want to hear the scary, salacious stuff. This is one of the issues when you leave the occult. As the psalm states, no one cares about your soul.
I’ve told you that I have had people push me to become a “public convert” and make the interview/blog/podcast rounds and I have staunchly resisted that. Others can manage it gracefully but have strong support networks and solid communities. I don’t have that support system and have found it makes me more vulnerable to despair and depression. I am therefore more cautious about how I present myself publicly.
After reading your post The Light From The Dark I was able to have a conversation about the fact that he has approximately 15 ex-pagans/occultists serving as catechumens for his Orthodox church. That’s astounding. It’s amazing to see so many people coming to Orthodoxy, especially in this year. This amazes me, and I am filled with wonderment and concern. There are so many people in need, and the fathers of the church have not had to deal for centuries with this influx.
Southern Baptist was my faith. There are many activities. Not much faith. When I was 11, I was a bit sour on church. My elderly Sunday school teacher, who was 84 years old, broke down and began to cry about how boys would use us and give us away like cigarettes. A reader wrote about the disturbing phenomenon of youth groups and Sunday school sexualization. You will soon realize that someone who is obsessed with your virginity becomes uncaring about your soul.
My parents were abusive and neglectful. It was awful. I won’t go into detail. When they stopped taking us to church, I tried to find faith on my own. I was confused. I felt that Evangelicalism had left me with the impression that God was too focused on my sexuality as a young girl. It only taught me how to interpret the Bible through a gendered and sexualized lens. After my father died, I left Christianity. It seemed that all the Bible’s women, with very few exceptions, were defined by their sex. I was a traumatized, obese, overweight, 17-year-old girl with no future. She didn’t know where she was going to eat next and had just lost the last stable person in her life. Naturally, I was susceptible to the occult.
The idea of God as a female was so healing in that moment. My misconceptions about Christianity were not corrected by anyone. I felt as though the God of the Bible had hated me and was without someone to talk to. I felt completely powerless and poor on every level. It is very difficult to imagine a God who loves one when you don’t have parents.
I found hope in the idea of magic and spells, gods that could be bargained with, or the power to the mind. I spent nearly two decades in occultism. There were many flavors and levels of commitment. The more active and involved I was, I felt more down.
It’s hard to believe that I didn’t get into a terrible cult. I needed to belong and be loved. Because people were kind to me, I joined groups that taught me things I didn’t believe. It shouldn’t surprise me that these people invariably hurt me, if I look back.
These communities were, ironically, obsessed with sex. It was believed that sex abuse was not a problem in pagan and occult circles, as they were more educated. In reality, sex abuse and harassment were not tolerated by pagan or occult circles. I believed I was sexually educated until I made poor choices that put me in a vulnerable situation and was raped.
From lighting candles and chanting affirmations to using Victorian rituals for summoning demons, I did it all. I was a part of a witchcraft organization that kept a portion of its teachings secret until I became a member. There was hope that you might understand the teachings once you had it. My initiation was very traumatizing. It involved me being pushed into my chest with a knife point. Then my blood was drawn, without my consent. (You’re deliberately disoriented prior). This was for the group leader to keep to use against me if I violate the secrecy oaths. The curse was that the tools and magic of witchcraft would turn against my, as they couldn’t see anyone not seeking power.
Once I became a member, I witnessed the entire rituals and summoning of Watchers. I was then shaken by a real demonic presence. It felt as though we were being surrounded by large, lizard-like creatures that were hostile to us. They seemed confused and unsure of what I was asking. It was then that I realized they weren’t believing what they were doing. It was spiritual LARPing. It was almost like babies playing with matches. They had found something that was somewhat therapeutic and it gave them a sense if identity. It also allowed them to indulge their passions. They summoned demons.
I don’t like woo-woo. I have a deep sense for skepticism about all ideas of miracles, angels and demons. Two decades spent in the occult taught me how to not roll my eyes at people talking about energy, faeries and other absurdities. That spiritual skepticism and tolerance spiritually numbed my eyes because I now realize that I don’t react negatively to spiritually unhealthy or blasphemy. With the support of my spiritual father, I am working on this. However, I do not see demons or ghosts lurking in every dark corner.
What does it mean to talk about demons in this context? Although I don’t enjoy talking about this topic, I think it is important. It invites in something, and that something is darkened and heavy. It is something that lurks in the shadows like an oil slick. Although it can be frightening, especially for the first time, it is often not as terrifying as what you need. It is benignly malevolent. It doesn’t seem to be particularly interested in you but it doesn’t necessarily mean well. It’s easier to do it again, and again, and so on. You romanticize it like a spiritual drug that gives you control. You don’t get what you want but you hold on to every little bit of success as a victory. Your life becomes more complicated, filled with lies, and more cognitive dissonance. Everything seems like an illusion. Your relationships suffer. The ritual and “magic” aren’t doing any good so you try to have a relationship with it. But the demon won’t let you. It wants to consume your body.
The demon does not want to be in a relationship. It wants to devour you.
After some distance, I believe the true goal of demons was to drive you to suicide so that you can be their forever.
Priests might not know how to deal with such people, I believe. Here are some things to consider when you hear someone claim they come from an occult, pagan, or other religious background.
+ A person is suffering from trauma and is currently in recovery. They should be treated with the same care and caution as someone who has just finished rehab for heroin addiction. Although spiritual damage may not be as evident as those caused by razor blades or needles, you can assume that they are severely damaged.
+ They don’t need to believe in evil. However, it will be difficult to convince them that there is good. It will be extremely difficult for them to believe that God loves them and forgives.
+ Some people may hold on to the church with tenacity, even to the point that it becomes legalism. However, they may also be as susceptible to conversion silliness as any other person.
+ They will be ashamed of their past and filled with confusion. They may require medical attention, including mental health care. However, they will be in great need of spiritual guidance. It may take some time for them to trust you. Pagan/occult communities can be full of people who have hurt others a lot.
+ They need a way to deal with their past and place it in perspective. Someone who has had to deal with demons in person cannot dismiss them as being not real or worthy for consideration. Fr. Stephen de Young hosts the podcast The Lord of Spirits. Andrew Stephen Damick, Fr Stephen de Young are excellent resources.
+ They will need tools to ground themselves in spiritual reality. It may take some time for them to feel spiritually secure. Prayer rules, holy water, and praying to St Michael are all good options. They will need all the support they can get. Although it may seem silly to them, they will find great comfort in the level of support, particularly if they desire things to be blessed.
+ They won’t find their lives any easier by accepting the salvation of Christ. The solution to all problems is not in baptism, chrismation, or communion. They need to view this as a beginning of salvation and recovery, not an end goal, perhaps more than any average convert. Particularly if they are from occult traditions that have levels, there is always another goal to reach.
+ They can’t assume certain basics. You may need to give them a deeper dive into morality and what is expected from a Christian. Do not assume that they know sexual morality. This is especially true if they have children with partners who aren’t Christians. You may need to discuss things that you wouldn’t normally, such as drug use or Orthodox views on ethnicity. This may be because they grew up in a culture where racism and psychedelics were accepted. However, they may be afraid of discussing this.
+ They won’t likely understand how to be involved in community life and will need guidance on how to participate in parish life.
+ They have heard a lot from smooth-talkers telling them what they want. They will appreciate you being honest with them and correcting their mistakes.
+ The I and II Corinthians are important to them to study and read, as St Paul is showing how a spiritual father loves and corrects and instructs people like these.
Orthodoxy has been receiving converts from many Christian traditions and non-religious Christians for a long time. However, I believe churches will see more “Corinthians” and that is a great thing.
You are correct. These converts will be faithful to their faith and thirsty for God if they are properly trained and supervised. They also face unique challenges that make it difficult for them to integrate into a healthy Christian community. Understanding that they have experienced demons in their lives is the first step to help them.
It has taken me more than two years to realize that I am free from the demons and God forgives me after spending over twenty years in occultism. Although I still have some way to go, I am thankful that God sent his priests to Corinth and Jerusalem. Photina was chosen as my patron saint. This is because I need to remind myself that God knows everything about my past and that he loves, forgives and values me regardless. Twenty years ago, I would have dismissed her for being a woman shamed and defined by sex. That I now see her as valorous, valiant, and victorious, equal-to-the-Apostles, apostle to the Samaritans, glorious martyr, and righteous saint says a lot about how Christ has changed me, and illumined my darkness with light.
>”… even the darkness is not black to you, the night is just as bright as the day, because darkness is as light as you. Psalm 139,12
